Some Raw programs are more equal than others

I’ve discussed before the possibilities of using extreme white balance shifts in your photography — it’s a common practice to hit an outdoor subject with amber light on a tungsten setting to make the sky deep blue, like so:

5980_647600870502_103264_37799231_6217405_n.jpg

But why stop there? It’s the digital era. If I’d hit them with a flash gelled deep pink, I could get crazy greens in the background. Or I could make that blue totally saturated.* It’s a way to get that crazy gelled-background look with just one light.

But some raw programs are much better at extreme shifts than others. Adobe Lightroom is great at making things super-warm, going to 50000K, but can only go as cold as to neutralize an old tungsten light bulb — anything lit by red is out of luck.

This isn’t just an issue for your own crazy lighting — if you shoot concerts or anything extremely theatrical, you often have to deal with lighting managers who are clearly on some sort of loosely-controlled substance. That’s where unlimited shifts come into play. RAW Developer is pretty good at this, with an auto setting that will use whatever crazy setting seems right, but is still limited compared to my favorite, Nikon Capture NX. With the “set gray point” option in the white balance, you can set it to essentially anything you want. For example, here’s some crazy lighting from a wedding singer, as it looked in real life:

090705-204635 _85.0 mm f_1.6 (2).jpg

Here’s the best that Lightroom could do with it (cropped slightly differently):

090705-204635 _85.0 mm f_1.6.jpg

But here’s what a simple adjustment in Capture NX did.

090705-204635 _85.0 mm f_1.6 (1).jpg

Look! She has skin tone! See how the open flame went to a crazy green? Non Nikon users may want to try their own maker’s software or RAW Developer.

UPDATE: By popular demand, here is what Apple’s Aperture can do. This actually taught me something I didn’t know — in Aperture, the white balance dropper can get you into extremes that the slider alone can’t do. While the settings for this read 2000K, -150, it was actually far more extremely shifted than if you had just manually moved the slider.

2009-07-05 20-46-35.jpg

*(Be careful lighting with greenish tones, it can highlight skin imperfections)

September 8, 2009 - 8:43 pm

Eric - Ryan,

Did you try using the white balance dropper tool on the guy’s shirt collar in the bottom left of the frame?

I tried it with your JPEG image and think it turned out closer to balanced than the second shot above. I didn’t get the warm skin tones like on the bottom shot, but I think I could get more out of the NEF file in Lightroom. Her teeth also worked pretty good with the dropper tool.

September 8, 2009 - 9:14 pm

Ryan Brenizer - That’s because you’re working the JPEG image that I already got halfway there. Adobe is a bit more wild with their JPG white balance, since it’s a different scale. But the Lightroom image was at the maximum settings (2000K, -150)

September 8, 2009 - 9:29 pm

Greg - Good info. do you have a feel for what Apple’s Aperture can do as a comparison?

Thx,

Greg

September 8, 2009 - 9:44 pm

kwb - And, it’s “Raw” instead of “RAW.” Check any Adobe manual. Raw is not an acronym. Otherwise, nice.

September 8, 2009 - 10:51 pm

Ryan Brenizer - It’s not often I run across someone more pedantic than myself. ;-)

September 8, 2009 - 10:58 pm

Ryan Brenizer - @Greg: View the update!

September 9, 2009 - 5:01 am

Max - This is a really good post – getting good colours especially skin tones) in lightroom has been almost impossible for me so its good to see that other programs can really do much better. LR is so bad that I started to get seriously paranoid about shooting under fluourescent light!

Just out of curiousity, what is your most commonly used Raw prog? Your pictures always have perfect skin tone!

September 9, 2009 - 6:44 am

Ryan Brenizer -

Just out of curiousity, what is your most commonly used Raw prog? Your pictures always have perfect skin tone!

Overall, Lightroom by far because of the incredible speed. But the photos presented o the blog are a split between Lightroom and NX.

September 9, 2009 - 7:52 am

Mike - Nice comparison! I found out last year that Lightroom’s temperature settings aren’t sufficiently low enough especially for specialized infrared work.

One solution, albeit clunky for the type of corrections you suggest in this blog, would be to be to create a custom camera profile for use in Lightroom to get extreme colour temperatures (i.e. for good IR photos I need a temperature in the range of 1600-1800K) – here’s a discussion I started on flickr about this:
http://www.flickr.com/groups/55027594@N00/discuss/72157606449595202/

Once again, clunky to do, and not precise, but there is a way to get extreme colour temperatures in Lightroom by building your own camera profiles.

September 9, 2009 - 9:09 am

kw - Aperture is truly a great program. I’ve been using it for long time for processing both nikon and canon files. It’s too bad people don’t see the power of Aperture and what it has to offer. With Nik plugins I never have to go to photoshop much anymore. Never used Nikon nx or Capture NX 2. I have used LR and much prefer Aperture. Just my two cents.
K-

September 9, 2009 - 9:16 am

Thomas Lester - Hey Ryan -

I’m an Aperture user and am aware of the dropper being able to go extreme (off the sliders). However… as you can see in your sample, Aperture gets the temperature pretty close, but seems to almost always screw up the tint. I almost always have to re-adjust the tint even when using a grey card target. And it’s not always consistent. Sometimes it’s heavy on the pink side, sometimes it’s heavy on the green side.

Did you try the dropper in LR? I would think that it would behave similarly to Aperture.

BTW… I love Capture NX2, but I just can’t wrap my head around an efficient work flow since CNX2 stinks for Digital Asset Management and it’s SLLLOOOWWWW….

September 9, 2009 - 10:05 am

Ryan Brenizer - I’ve never had LR’s dropper go extreme.

September 9, 2009 - 1:24 pm

Kyle - Going to see what Canon’s program has to offer as far as white balance goes. Skin toes are my achilles tendon.

And YAY, Ryan has a blog we can all comment on!

September 9, 2009 - 3:21 pm

Eric - “That’s because you’re working the JPEG image that I already got halfway there.”

Actually, I tried the dropper on the first image, not the second one that had already been processed in LR. Thanks for the update in Aperture though.

September 9, 2009 - 4:42 pm

Sean McCormack - Steven Erat sent me over for a look.

Using the DNG Profile Editor you can quite easily make a much cooler white balance and save it as a profile.

I use this technique for Infrared, but it would work equally as well in this application.

http://lightroom-blog.com/2009/05/creating-ir-camera-profile.html

September 9, 2009 - 9:25 pm

Maria - Hi!, you always use Lightroom for editing because I´m your fan and I tried Aperture, photoshop and NX2, but always finish some effect in photoshop, If don´t edit a lot of photos which program do you say that is the best for more quality (forget the speed) and the photo before the aperture edit is finished in NX2 ? but started in Lightroom?

—I love you Ryan (your work) you inspired me-

September 9, 2009 - 9:59 pm

Ryan Brenizer - Thank you Maria! Your comment is a bit hard to understand because of the language barrier, but in terms of absolute quality I will usually go with NX, with photoshop for fine detail work.

September 9, 2009 - 10:13 pm

Dolly - I absolutely love this post. Those pictures of the background are my absolute favorite.

September 10, 2009 - 5:06 am

Simon - Thanks so much for this Ryan, this is the one problem with LR for me…View NX works way better for those rare shots where LR fails. Now if Nikon would only make it work faster and not charge extra for NX2 I’d be much happier.
Love the new blog BTW, long-time fan of your Amazon blog…

September 13, 2009 - 1:38 am

Alex - Ryan – Dealing with the white balance is always something hard for me. Could share some handy hints about what “simple adjustment” you did in NX to get this awesome skin tone out of the sluggish enlightenment.
Love your new blog too btw.

September 17, 2009 - 8:08 pm

Ryan Brenizer — New York City Wedding Photographer : For You Blue - [...] More extreme white balance? Nope — this is exactly what the scene looked like in real life, thanks to the crazy night lights at the High Line. [...]

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